Respect Due.

Some McCain supporters call some of the wingnuts out.

Props.

19 thoughts on “Respect Due.

  1. shani-o October 20, 2008 at 2:44 pm Reply

    Respect due? To whom? To the perfectly normal McCain supporters we all know exist? To the McCain campaign for sending out their token Muslim to attack the nut?

    Please. This video was cute and all, but it doesn’t change the fact that McCain didn’t denounce the wingnuts until he started getting criticized for the tone that he and his runningmate welcomed.

    I have no respect for this at all.

  2. shani-o October 20, 2008 at 2:48 pm Reply

    And just to add: why do his supporters deserve props for doing the right thing? You think they would’ve jumped on dude if there hadn’t been a camera and a reporter there? The only difference between the nuts and the normal supporters is that the latter knows which way the wind is blowing.

  3. G.D. October 20, 2008 at 3:06 pm Reply

    shani-o: as we saw at the other McCain rallies, it’s perfectly possible for people to sit by quietly while this bullshit happens. it’s not quite as easy as you’re suggesting.

  4. shani-o October 20, 2008 at 3:12 pm Reply

    G.D. = Like I said, they know which way the wind is blowing. With all the press that McCain rallies have generated in the last few weeks, his supporters are rethinking how they handle the nuts.

  5. shani-o October 20, 2008 at 3:17 pm Reply

    Also, how many people were at that rally? How many walked by before the young kid spoke up? Sorry, I’m not going to give these people an inch, just for being decent. Too little, too late.

  6. K. October 20, 2008 at 7:18 pm Reply

    the video looks staged to me.

  7. universeexpanding October 21, 2008 at 7:09 am Reply

    Yeah, I dunno if I believe that was real. Seemed a touch too convenient, especially at this juncture.

  8. simply scott October 21, 2008 at 8:05 am Reply

    It’s kinda nice to see people being real and honest. The conventional wisdom in this country, I think, is that “good Christian” means ‘intolerant, ignorant asshole’, and I think we’ve seen that in a lot of recent videos associated with McCain supporters. It’s nice to see some intolerant jerks, who cannot even support their own position but are spreading hate, shut down by some open-minded, intelligent conservatives. Bravo for getting the other side of the story. I wonder when these moderate, Muslim conservatives will be at the next Palin rally to shout down the people who call Obama a “terrorist” and a “Muslim”, as if the latter is an epithet.

    Of course, it could have been staged. Hell, we’ve seen better hoaxes, and of course, we’ve also seen people “do the right thing” in public or on camera when they would normally just ignore it and not get involved otherwise.

    Reminds me of an excellent article I just read yesterday in Playboy (yep) in which people nowadays ignore facts, like how Obama is a Christian, and just have their own beliefs, like how he is a Muslim. The article is called “Truthiness”, but I just call the phenomenon “stupidity”.

  9. quadmoniker October 21, 2008 at 8:27 am Reply

    Shani-o: I disagree. You’re probably right that the supporters might not have done anything without a camera there. But that’s why the press exists. To call people to a higher level of responsibility.

  10. shani-o October 21, 2008 at 8:50 am Reply

    QM- I know why the press exists. I went to J-School. And they were doing their job. That still doesn’t mean anyone in that video deserves praise.

  11. quadmoniker October 21, 2008 at 8:53 am Reply

    Why Not? Because they acted that way when they knew people were watching? I’m not going to begrudge people anyone praise on that account, because we’re all guilty in that regard.

  12. shani-o October 21, 2008 at 9:09 am Reply

    No one moved until the McCain spokesman showed up. No one said anything until he started criticizing the guy. If you want to call me a hypocrite, that’s fine. But my complaint is not about acting right because people are watching, it’s about the fact that they started acting right after they got the go-ahead from the McCain spokesman.

  13. verdeluz October 21, 2008 at 4:43 pm Reply

    shani-o: How, exactly, do you know what anybody did or did not say prior to the beginning of this footage? It would be just as easy for people to stay quiet with the camera there; I’m more inclined to see the presence of the cameraman as an incitement to those who were already upset to speak up. It’s a whole lot easier to confront somebody directly when you’re not the only one doing so.

    The whole “these people” thing is a bit ridiculous- McCain supporters may be, you know, wrong, but they’re not a homogeneous group of backward-thinking hatemongers.

  14. shani-o October 21, 2008 at 5:03 pm Reply

    Verdeluz: First of all, I’m pretty sure I called the McCain supporters who spoke up “perfectly normal” in my first comment. I don’t think I referred to them as a “homogeneous” or “backward-thinking hatemongers.” And your usage of the words “these people” implies something different than what I meant. I was specifically referring to the people on the screen, hence, “these people.” Not some nebulous, scary group of “these people.”

    I’m not sure what your point is about the camera vs. the cameraman being a reason that people spoke up. I don’t disagree that it’s easier to say something when you’re not alone.

    However, I suggest that McCain’s reasonable supporters are aware of the negative attention the rallies have been receiving and that this has driven their desire to speak out against the wingnuts. I also don’t think that’s good enough. It’s too little, too late. I’m clearly alone on this, but my opinion is what it is.

  15. verdeluz October 21, 2008 at 5:25 pm Reply

    shani, wrt your previous comments, I’m having a little trouble differentiating between the supporters who qualify as “perfectly normal” and the “these people” that don’t deserve “an inch”; I don’t think anybody was applauding the people who were subsequently driven away.

    I wasn’t making a distinction between the camera and the cameraman. My point was in response to your assertion that people voiced their disapproval only because someone was watching. There may be some truth to that, but I think it’s overly cynical to identify it- or bad PR- as the main or only reasons. If you’re willing to concede that there have always been “normal” McCain supporters, I see no reason to think that the people speaking up in this or other similar cases are not part of that group and that they haven’t been turned off by the hate all along.

  16. shani-o October 21, 2008 at 5:45 pm Reply

    I’m having a little trouble differentiating between the supporters who qualify as “perfectly normal” and the “these people” that don’t deserve “an inch”; I don’t think anybody was applauding the people who were subsequently driven away.

    I made no differentiation. I’ve already attempted to make my point, but as it’s not working, I’ll copy and paste the salient bits, and hope that this can be conclusive.

    First I said: “This video was cute and all, but it doesn’t change the fact that McCain didn’t denounce the wingnuts until he started getting criticized for the tone that he and his runningmate welcomed.”

    Then I said: “With all the press that McCain rallies have generated in the last few weeks, his supporters are rethinking how they handle the nuts.”

    Then I said: “But my complaint is not about acting right because people are watching, it’s about the fact that they started acting right after they got the go-ahead from the McCain spokesman.”

    And to you I said: “I suggest that McCain’s reasonable supporters are aware of the negative attention the rallies have been receiving and that this has driven their desire to speak out against the wingnuts. I also don’t think that’s good enough. It’s too little, too late.”

    The thing is, no one here has refuted my repeated point, which is that “these people” (the people in this video, whom one considers normal; as well as people in previous videos) have appeared to let the Muslim/socialist/racism thing go until it the campaign stepped in. If you want to say that they *should* be taking their cues from the campaign, well, that’s a different discussion.

    My point was in response to your assertion that people voiced their disapproval only because someone was watching.

    This assertion was a minor point; I concede to you.

    If you’re willing to concede that there have always been “normal” McCain supporters, I see no reason to think that the people speaking up in this or other similar cases are not part of that group and that they haven’t been turned off by the hate all along.

    Nor do I. That’s not the point I was making.

    The most uncharitable thing I said, was early on: “The only difference between the nuts and the normal supporters is that the latter knows which way the wind is blowing.” I regret saying that, because it isn’t true.

  17. verdeluz October 21, 2008 at 5:55 pm Reply

    Watch the video again. If we’re seeing the events in the order they took place, the campaign spokesperson intervened in a confrontation that was already taking place between the ridiculously hot Kurdish woman and the original subject of the interview. He shows up *after* the fact, not before.

  18. shani-o October 21, 2008 at 6:01 pm Reply

    I don’t see why hot-Kurdish-woman-who-is-Muslim would have a problem speaking up, though maybe I’m naive. I’m talking about the “open-minded conservative Christian” folk, who don’t come in until later.

  19. nancy October 23, 2008 at 5:14 pm Reply

    You know I think if McCain had stopped the negative foul abusive remarks weeks ago he may have had some type of chance. But I am so voting for Obama. This country does not need the ranting of a mad man. And Barbie well let’s leave her out of this..Don’t get me on her topics.
    I once and I say once thought of Him as a hero. But I think he has played that line long enough.
    He has become the most untrusted man I can think of. He makes Bush look good. Even Bush did not tell and do the lying that the MCPalin camp is doing. I am so disgusted. I just received one of his negative robo calls. I was appalled, such verbal abuse. My 82 dad a war veteran also just received in the mail one of the very negative mailings.ALso asking him for money to put an end to those democrats and liberal people…People? we are all americans look around. I am not anti american because I do not believe all your lies. Tells a lot about the man. Like they say back a wild animal into a corner and he will attack. That is what I see in those two. Wild animals on the attack. So uncivilized. We are supposed to be one nation under God..WHO is their god. I know in my faith you do unto your neighbors as you would want done to you!

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